[Patch 3.2] Joining The Emblem Debate
Any dungeons that previously dropped Emblems of Heroism or Valor, such as Naxxramas or Heroic Halls of Stone, will now drop Emblems of Conquest instead. Emblems of Conquest can still be converted to Valor or Heroism.o The heroic dungeon daily quest will now reward 2 Emblems of Triumph and the normal daily dungeon quest will reward 1 Emblem of Triumph.
The existing achievements to collect 1, 25, 50, etc. Emblems of Heroism, Valor, and Conquest have been converted to Feats of Strength since Heroism and Valor Emblems are no longer attainable.
New achievements have been added to collect various amounts of any combination of emblems.
So everything that is currently in game, except Ulduar25, will drop the same Emblem. The tiered emblem system is officially being scrapped.
I’m really torn about this change. It opens up an entire segment of gear that was previously unavailable to me. We were just starting to get some Emblems in Conquest in our Raids as we did Hard Modes, but not very many. Now I’ll be able to stockpile a mess of EoConquest. I should be able to buy the Runed Orbs I need to get the BoE Blacksmithing Boots and Belt made for both Ret and Prot.
I speculate the Emblem of Triumph is the new Emblem that will be dropping in new Raid, The Crusader’s Coliseum. The new raid is actually 4 raids in one. It will have normal 10 and 25 man modes plus a Hard 10 and a Hard 25 man mode. The really nice change here is that the Hard modes are on a separate lockout. You can do normal mode AND Hard mode in the same week. Hard mode will be called Heroic.
Emblems of Triumph will drop when run in both 25 man modes and 10 man Heroic. 10 man normal will likely drop Emblems of Conquest. Of course, this is all speculation at this point.
It’s remarkable to me that Emblems of Triumph will be awarded by doing the Daily Heroic and Daily Normal Dungeon. We’ll have to wait and see what is available to purchase with Emblems of Triumph but I would expect it would be Crusader Coliseum level loot.
This would assuredly get Honorshammer back in running Heroics, and running them often. People are always looking for a Tank to do the Daily Heroic.
So yes, I’m pretty excited about having some additional gear options opened up to me.
This will also help the raid group since we’ve had some turnover. Real life has taken the priority it needs to take for a couple of our core team. We have to gear up some new raiders and teach them the ropes so to speak.
This change will make it much easier to get them up to the level of the rest of the raid fairly quickly. That is a positive for my raid group.
But I’m also concerned.
The Emblem change may make it tougher on Raiding guilds. Loot is a reward, a trophy, and it’s a tool for seeing more content, but it’s also a motivator. I speculate it will be harder for some Raid leaders to get their groups to wipe for hours on content. Some of those raiders are going to be thinking to themselves, why are we doing this? We could be getting just as good, if not a little better gear by facerolling our way through Kara….err I mean Naxx, and Heroics. And to a certain extent, they would be right.
If your raid has people who only raid for gear, you might have trouble motivating them. Money or gear doesn’t change a person so much as it reveals a person.
Although, I think if I’m honest with myself what really bothers me about the Emblem change is that a guy who dinged 80 last week could be in the same or maybe even better gear than a person like, oh I don’t know, let’s say… me! I’ve been around since the opening of Wrath of the Lich King.
I guess I want to have some advantage for playing longer or having been around that long.
Actually I do have an advantage. Unless we’re talking about an alt, that person who just dinged will not know what it was like those first couple of weeks in Ulduar. They won’t have any clue what it was like questing through Dragonblight when it was buzzing with activity, or doing Heroics in mostly blue gear. I got exactly what I paid for: exploration, progression, and entertainment.
I raid because it’s fun to raid. I love getting loot as a reward, and as a tool to be ready to tackle the next raid zone. I do like the fact that I’m one of handful of people on my server to have killed Yogg Saron on any difficulty (10 or 25 man). I love that we got a server first on Shadowdodger.
I guess I just want some way to be recognized as a deep end game player. Gear is part of that, but titles and achievements can serve that purpose as well. I suppose it’s why I still wear Hand of A’dal around Shattrah. I can't wait until I can wear Conqueror of Ulduar, or Starcaller.
New people or alts getting gear through the new Emblem system won’t diminish my fun in Raids at all. Sure, they’ll have gear. I hope they go out and have a blast with that gear.
Maybe it will help some guild get over a stumbling block like Thorim or Mimiron, or maybe it will help them finally down Yogg. Even better, perhaps it will give a Naxx guild confidence to go try Ulduar. The place is a lot of fun to raid.
Raiding is fun, why wouldn’t I want others to experience the fun I’ve been having.
So overall the Emblem change is quite good. I have to be honest with myself about what bothers me about it, and I soon as I am, I realize that it’s not anything to be concerned about.
The existing achievements to collect 1, 25, 50, etc. Emblems of Heroism, Valor, and Conquest have been converted to Feats of Strength since Heroism and Valor Emblems are no longer attainable.
New achievements have been added to collect various amounts of any combination of emblems.
So everything that is currently in game, except Ulduar25, will drop the same Emblem. The tiered emblem system is officially being scrapped.
I’m really torn about this change. It opens up an entire segment of gear that was previously unavailable to me. We were just starting to get some Emblems in Conquest in our Raids as we did Hard Modes, but not very many. Now I’ll be able to stockpile a mess of EoConquest. I should be able to buy the Runed Orbs I need to get the BoE Blacksmithing Boots and Belt made for both Ret and Prot.
I speculate the Emblem of Triumph is the new Emblem that will be dropping in new Raid, The Crusader’s Coliseum. The new raid is actually 4 raids in one. It will have normal 10 and 25 man modes plus a Hard 10 and a Hard 25 man mode. The really nice change here is that the Hard modes are on a separate lockout. You can do normal mode AND Hard mode in the same week. Hard mode will be called Heroic.
Emblems of Triumph will drop when run in both 25 man modes and 10 man Heroic. 10 man normal will likely drop Emblems of Conquest. Of course, this is all speculation at this point.
It’s remarkable to me that Emblems of Triumph will be awarded by doing the Daily Heroic and Daily Normal Dungeon. We’ll have to wait and see what is available to purchase with Emblems of Triumph but I would expect it would be Crusader Coliseum level loot.
This would assuredly get Honorshammer back in running Heroics, and running them often. People are always looking for a Tank to do the Daily Heroic.
So yes, I’m pretty excited about having some additional gear options opened up to me.
This will also help the raid group since we’ve had some turnover. Real life has taken the priority it needs to take for a couple of our core team. We have to gear up some new raiders and teach them the ropes so to speak.
This change will make it much easier to get them up to the level of the rest of the raid fairly quickly. That is a positive for my raid group.
But I’m also concerned.
The Emblem change may make it tougher on Raiding guilds. Loot is a reward, a trophy, and it’s a tool for seeing more content, but it’s also a motivator. I speculate it will be harder for some Raid leaders to get their groups to wipe for hours on content. Some of those raiders are going to be thinking to themselves, why are we doing this? We could be getting just as good, if not a little better gear by facerolling our way through Kara….err I mean Naxx, and Heroics. And to a certain extent, they would be right.
If your raid has people who only raid for gear, you might have trouble motivating them. Money or gear doesn’t change a person so much as it reveals a person.
Although, I think if I’m honest with myself what really bothers me about the Emblem change is that a guy who dinged 80 last week could be in the same or maybe even better gear than a person like, oh I don’t know, let’s say… me! I’ve been around since the opening of Wrath of the Lich King.
I guess I want to have some advantage for playing longer or having been around that long.
Actually I do have an advantage. Unless we’re talking about an alt, that person who just dinged will not know what it was like those first couple of weeks in Ulduar. They won’t have any clue what it was like questing through Dragonblight when it was buzzing with activity, or doing Heroics in mostly blue gear. I got exactly what I paid for: exploration, progression, and entertainment.
I raid because it’s fun to raid. I love getting loot as a reward, and as a tool to be ready to tackle the next raid zone. I do like the fact that I’m one of handful of people on my server to have killed Yogg Saron on any difficulty (10 or 25 man). I love that we got a server first on Shadowdodger.
I guess I just want some way to be recognized as a deep end game player. Gear is part of that, but titles and achievements can serve that purpose as well. I suppose it’s why I still wear Hand of A’dal around Shattrah. I can't wait until I can wear Conqueror of Ulduar, or Starcaller.
New people or alts getting gear through the new Emblem system won’t diminish my fun in Raids at all. Sure, they’ll have gear. I hope they go out and have a blast with that gear.
Maybe it will help some guild get over a stumbling block like Thorim or Mimiron, or maybe it will help them finally down Yogg. Even better, perhaps it will give a Naxx guild confidence to go try Ulduar. The place is a lot of fun to raid.
Raiding is fun, why wouldn’t I want others to experience the fun I’ve been having.
So overall the Emblem change is quite good. I have to be honest with myself about what bothers me about it, and I soon as I am, I realize that it’s not anything to be concerned about.
Comments
Do I like getting loot? Sure, in a monkey-pushing-the-button-for-drugs kind of way, but the real reason I like getting loot is so I can help my raid see more bosses. That's why I started selling glyphs big-time. With gold I bought EoV bracers for me and wife, BoE gloves for wife, and much more.
The little psychological boost you get from winning a piece of loot in the raid isn't there, but it means I can help push us further.
I'm not torn on this change one bit. Blizzard wants everyone to see all this content they've spent hundreds, maybe thousands of man-hours crafting. That's all I really want, too. Sure, I enjoy banging our heads on a boss working things out. I enjoy joking around with my raidgroup. I like stepping forward and saying "Sorry guys, that was all my fault," and I certainly love hearing "Duc, you're epic!" from time to time.
But I really like seeing the content. Seeing how the bosses work. Enjoying the new encounters, although BLizzard's "don't stand in the stuff" design standard is getting long in the tooth, it's still fun.
WotLK brought with it the (I hate this buzzword) paradigm-shifting idea of PuG Raiding at the endgame. Before Ulduar, we saw lots of Naxx PuGs. Now there's Ulduar PuGs. I love that. Anything Blizzard can do to make it more possible for more people to actually see all this cool stuff they made is a good thing. I would never want to see a return to the days of Molten Core where a mind-bogglingly miniscule percentage of the players actually got to see more of that instance than the first pull.
Yes, I know my opinion will not be liked by the long-time raiders, in general, but that's ok. I have about 3 hours per week to raid due to scheduling of my raidgroup. Rarely we get another 2 hours. Maybe twice in the last 4 months. I'm glad Blizzard are working to make sure I see the rest of Ulduar.
Another take: Consider your Warrior Alt - now gearing him to be able to take over if Paladins ever get patch-ganked will be much, much easier.
The most important reason why I am in favor of this is that it gives badges a purpose again. Right now as you said you have no need or desire to run heroics. It is impossible to get geared people to run heroics or even worse a 10 man naxx because they simply dont offer anything for them. I used to run kara every weekend simply for the badges, and here is the big thing.. yes it was a step towards getting loot through badges but more importantly it was a social thing. It was me hanging out with my 9 other buddies joking around and blasting through kara. This aspect of the game is totally missing. Buddies dont run heroics anymore becuase they dont need to and the social aspect is gone.
How many people lately have you heard of quitting the game becuase they dont find it fun anymore. They just log on for raids and thats it. They didnt do dailies they never ran heroics etc. Karthis from of teeth and claws was a perfect example of this.
I think the badge system right now is the worst thing blizzard did for the game. It made raiding the only way you can get gear and guess what you can only do that so much cause yo can only get 25 people together so often. Bringing a purpose back to badges is in my opinion the best way to get people back online hanging out with their friends and blasting through content.. but most importantly enjoying the game again.
And while you can get a good set of gear from Conquest only, it's not nearly as good as what you'll be able to get from Triumph. As it stands, no, you don't have anything to show for running your instances now compared to those who just did it.
Just like you don't have anything to show for doing MC 4 years ago compared to the guy who just did it with 4 guys while they were waiting for their 5v5 team. That's the nature of the game. If you don't like that part, not sure what else you're going to be able to do.