Wednesday, July 1, 2009

You Aren't What You Used To Be

There was a time in my Paladin's life when I could tell healers and DPS the World of Warcraft over, "As long as you stand in the Consecrate, you're safe." Other tanks learned that once a mob was in the Consecrate, they weren't pulling it off me without a taunt.

That doesn't appear to be the case anymore. Mobs run right through my Consecrate and keep on trucking. I've lost mobs in AoE situations to Fan of Knives, and Death and Decay.

The first time I really noticed it was during our Sarth 2D and 3D raids, when I was Whelp Tanking. Then I have especially noticed it in Ulduar on stuff like Hodir's Worm trash, Mimiron's Trash trash and Thorim's whole arena. In fact, it was my failure in the Arena that really got me thinking about Consecration again.

I know that spells like Blizzard can crit now and they couldn’t in Burning Crusade. But Consecrate seems to lack burst threat. It’s nice threat over time but there’s just no burst. Shockwave at least stops the mobs in their tracks with a stun.

That lack of burst hurts because I tend to think people are a lot less careful with AoE now than they ever have been. We started AoEing trash in 3.0, and then we got the pure AoE fest that was and is Heroics and Naxx. People just don’t wait for AoE anymore. You wait on your AoE and you’ll get destroyed on the meters. Next thing you know someone is whispering the Raid Leader about replacing you.

I understand that Paladins aren't pure AoE tanks anymore. Every tank can AoE tank quite well, and I think that's been a good change for the game. I'm more looking to figure out how to keep my DPS/Healers alive on Thorim's Arena and the like.

The other problem I had in AoE situations was that because I wasn’t getting hit, I quickly ran myself OOM.

I think my biggest problem is my First Person Shooter skills have really declined over the past couple of years. One of the big skills in an FPS game is what I call See-Shoot-Kill. See your target, identify him as an enemy (especially important in games that support Friend Fire), and open fire on him. Often when playing with friends, they would tell me they were dead before they saw me. That See-Shoot-Kill was just a reflex. I need that kind of reflex in the Arena. See the Warbringer, shoot him with Avenger’s Shield, or Exorcism.

It gets harder when multiple elite spawn, as they do in the later stages of the encounter. That’s usually when I lose a Black (Priest) or Donk (Mage) or Ofn (Rogue) or Mag (Ret Paladin).

I wound up having to take the Tunnel and let Ellevis (Blood Death Knight) handle the Arena.

I wish there was some way, or some where I could go practice Thorim’s Arena a couple of times without endangering my raid group, but we went ahead and killed him.

Lastly, I feel the pain that fellow Paladin Tank blogger Rhidach is going through. He’s killed Flame Leviathan every reset (11 times) and never seen Titanguard.

I’ve killed Flame Leviathan 9 times. No Flamewatch Armguards. They didn’t drop the 2 times I wasn’t there either. 11 Kologarn kills, 1 Mark of Unyeidling that I lost to my co-Tank, Ellevis (Blood Death Knight). We’ve done XT Hard at least 4 or 5 times, but no gun for our Hunters.

Indeed, the RNG can be a cruel mistress.


Lochagos said...

Burst AOE threat seems to have an easy solution to me - change holy wrath to hit everything like they did with exorism. I do it all the time on Naxx trash. If it isn't OP there why not be able to do it everywhere?

Therigwin said...

I have noticed it a little that Consecration is not what it used to be, but I make sure I am using the Librim of Resurgence for trash and I find it as not as of a big deal.

Plus, I run with good dps (my wife's rogue) and she makes sure she tricks on me before she fan of knives.

But overall, I am not finding it as bad as you are making it out to be, or it could just be the dps I am running with is not as good as the dps in your groups.

mandm413 said...

Part of the problem is always that dps gears up faster than tanks do but I think like you pointed out honor they don't wait anymore to start their aoe.

I just run pug heroics and rarely a naxx but they got so used to easy fodder and overgearing encounters that they feel its not their job to watch the threat meters anymore. DPS needs to be retrained that if they pull aggro and die its their fault not the tanks.

Also, I am not sure how good it would be in ulduar but I have loved the glyped hammer that hits 4 targets instead of 3. Its a good replacement for what consecration used to be as far as gaining and holding aoe aggro.

Adlib said...

I miss the power of the pally's consecration! I'm a mage, and since I'm probably the only one not obsessed with damage meters, I am careful with my AoE. That probably lowers my dps, but I'd rather be alive then dead with some of my other guildie mages who just cut loose with the AoE before tanks even have the mobs half the time. Anyway, I agree with you; it would be nice to have such a "sticky" tank like before.

Argon said...

Thorim's arena is probably the hardest thing to tank in Ulduar, in my opinion. My strategy is to keep down a consecrate to pick up the tiny adds, and to concentrate on getting aggro on the Warbringers and the Champions (unless it is 25 man, and we have a separate tank for Champions). The little healer guys don't do much damage. DPS seems to often die because they start in on the Warbringers before you have aggro, so you need to warn them about that.

Make sure everybody in the arena is in the little circle. The only exceptions should be the Champion tank, in 25, and a shadow priest that is mind controlling. People standing outside the circle can be a pain because mobs tend to run for them, but multi-target taunting off them works fairly well.

Crofe said...

I completely agree with the AoE and DPS being impatient in general. And I say that from a Tankadin and from an Elemental Shaman point of view. As a Tankadin, I cringe on AoE pulls anymore because I know people are going to die, but there's not much more I can do to prevent it. If they could wait a few seconds so I could have a bit of a lead before they start, it'd go better.

As an Elemental Shaman, I know the drive of wanting to DPS as soon as you can. Yeah, it's a meters game. I feel I should be doing a certain amount of damage and when I don't, I think it's because I waited too long to start killing things.

whatsmymain said...

In situations where Pallies are reliant on consecration such as in the arena, I wonder if a spell power weapon would give higher dot damage. I'd imagine an extra 500 sp could be a good boost in threat and you can allways switch to your reg tanking weapon when thorim lands.